!!!!! This book is fantastic and has really helped me understand the Gospel more fully and clearly. Absolutely beautiful!
I think the thing that stands out for me in this chapter is the fact that Jesus WANTS to be known by us!!! As it states in pg. 57, He could have left us destitute of the knowledge of Himself, but He chose to pursue us despite our denial of Him and our wanderings. I see more clearly His heart and relentless pursuit of man — a desire for man to be in relationship with Him, by sending the only One that could recreate the image of the Father, to bring anew the heart of man. And on top of this beautiful truth, He reveals Himself to man in numerous ways. Amazing!!!
Another Gospel connection I had was that part of the reason God sent Jesus to earth as a man, was because man was searching for God among created things rather than the Creator. Romans 1:23. I am moved by how generous our God is.
Question to work through:
Angels don’t carry the image of God? Someone share some scripture and walk me through this please!
That's right, angels do not bear the Image of God. They are not made in His likeness. They are created with a different purpose and design. We get insight into this purpose in Hebrews 2: "13And to which of the angels has he ever said, “Sit at my right hand
until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet”? 14Are they not all ministering spirits sent out to serve for the sake of those who are to inherit salvation?"
Angels have been created with various forms and purposes, but their overarching purpose is to serve God and those made in the Image of God: Man. Which brings me to our own purpose: to reflect the likeness of God, to make the invisible God visible in the world, glorifying Him. As those uniquely made in His Image, Humans are the only beings in creation which can do this. Angels cannot, which is part of what Hebrews is trying to establish when it asserts that Jesus was not an angel, but a Man. If angels were made in God's Image, they would have been redeemed by Jesus sacrifice as well, but as it is, they are not and cannot be redeemed by Jesus' death and resurrection.
Again I am reminded how God is so relational and personal. He desires to be known; He is not a far-off God. Page 59 gets into this, "He had not hidden Himself from the sight of men, nor given the knowledge of Himself in one way only; but rather, He had unfolded it in many forms and by many ways." God has given us so many opportunities to see Him and know Him. Praise Him! This is so very different from every other religion and it burdens my hear to know that so many people are devoted to gods who don't love them and don't care about them. If only they knew the Truth!
As Athanasius explains on page 65, humans have looked to the created to find objects of worship, among the 'things of sense.' This made me think of 1 Samuel 8. Where the people of God are desiring a human king to judge and govern them, because they had rejected God as their king. They were turning to the created, to the things of sense. Yes, God does give them earthly, purely human kings but eventually and ultimately He gives us King Jesus, the God-Man. He answers their desire with Himself. He gives us a human king who can perfectly rule and govern as God, but also reveals God to us in a very personal way.
Questions:
Page 59 states that "being made in His image was sufficient to give them knowledge of the Word." Is this referring to a conscience that all humans have? Just because we are made in the Image and are 'reasonable,' that should point us to the Creator? I think of Romans 2:14-15, that everyone has a conscience and should be able to see how their conscience points to a creator. Is this what Athanasius is saying here?
Page 67 speaks of Jesus's omnipresence. I understand how Jesus's mind is not contained, how He is still upholding the universe with the word of His power. But I am curious if this means He was also present in heaven while His body was doing ministry on earth? Or is it that He was only physically present in one place but spiritually present everywhere? How does this work?
To your first question: I think Athanasius answers your question on page 58 when he says, "through this gift of Godlikeness in themselves they may be able to perceive the Image Absolute, that is the Word Himself, and through Him to apprehend the Father". I think what we gain by being "like God," namely our reason and rationality, enables us to perceive the One we were made after the likeness of: Jesus. And in coming to know Jesus, we come to know the Father, for they are one, Jesus being the Image of the Father, the exact imprint of His nature.
To your second question: this is a tough one. I think I would say the Word of God was, and is now, both in one place as He is embodied in the person of Jesus, and also omnipresent as the spiritual power through which all things are being held together. This is a bit sticky and I'm not sure of all the implications of that explanation, but I think that is how I would understand the nature of the Word's dwelling in creation. Would be a good question to bring to more people around you!
Hey Jaelyn!!! Great connecting with you here! I really appreciate your thoughts and questions. I don’t have answers, but am just here to say that I appreciate your intentionality and thought. Praise God for community and this study!!
"You cannot put straight in others what is warped in yourself." Page 63
This is why Jesus needed to come.
This is also why, even today, we need the Spirit to draw people to Himself.
Sure, my words and actions can point to Him (fallen and warped as I am) but ultimately it is God to straighten the lives of His people. It is God only and He deserves all glory for it.
When talking about Jesus, Athanasius said, "He Himself is not man only but also God, the Word and Wisdom of the true God." Page 66
This is such a worshipful statement! It comes after saying how Jesus desired to centre our senses on Himself.
Reminds me of the many times my tummy has been growling and I can smell dinner cooking. All I can think about and all I can wait for is a plate full of food in front of me 😋
Do I wait for my Savior like that? Do I approach His Word each morning hungry and wanting to be satisfied?
What a beautiful picture this puts in my mind 🥰
Athanasius ends this section with "The Self-revealing of the Word is in every dimension ... All things have been filled with the knowledge of God."
Makes me want to intentionally look for God throughout my day, especially at work when it's easy to forget I'm a Christian first and an employee second.
When reading through this chapter and everyone's comments, I am reminded of all the ways (both known and unknown) that God works in each of our lives.
Using my own life as an example, it is quite amazing to look at the last 8 years (high school graduation until today) and recognize the undeniable hand that Jesus has played in my path. To give just a brief overview -- I grew up in the Lutheran church, was baptized as a baby, and completed confirmation classes during my middle school years.
I took a government class in high school and was formally introduced to politics. At the time, I loathed the way Christianity was represented in politics and felt I didn't see my own reflection in the events and behaviors playing out in our country. Ignorantly, I decided that Christianity was a main part of the problem and decided to remove myself from the church, as I no longer believed I belonged. (Reflecting on this now, I think a significant portion of this misguided belief was a failure to recognize a personal relationship with God and instead viewing Christianity as a "hive mind" or mass mode of thinking.)
I stayed away from church for about 5 years. I spent 3.5 of these years in a serious relationship with someone who was a fervent Christ-denier and openly mocked both Christians and Christianity. However, during those same years, I was exposed to some of his best friends. They were some of the kindest, warmest, brightest people I've met in my life -- all of them devout believers, Christians through and through. I felt at home with these people and had my first re-exposures to Christianity in their presence. After that relationship ended, I did a lot reflecting and soul-searching, and I decided that Christianity cannot be that bad if those people were so good. I decided to give things another go (this was 1.5 years ago), and I remember my first church service, essentially as a "new Christian" who hadn't seriously practiced as an adult. The first words of the service were a welcome and acknowledgement that no matter who you were, what you believed, or what you'd been through, you were welcome. Dear reader, I was nearly in tears!
Although I don't frequent that church anymore, I haven't looked back. Mere months after this first service, I met the man who would become my husband. It was only then that I remembered, 8 years ago, some of the last prayers I prayed were for a "good, Christian man" to be my partner in life. God delivered on that, too!
I'm sure we all have stories like this, and I know we can find lots of examples in the Bible as well. I often think about how important mission work is and find myself worrying about people who haven't had the opportunity to be exposed to Jesus. What happens to them if they didn't even have a chance to learn? But, in reading this chapter and thinking through experiences like my own, I'm reminded that we can look to each other and find God in one another. Athanasius points it out as well, noting that God sent prophets to help us learn of Him if we aren't able to discern him throughout the tangible universe. Jesus desires to know us and for us to know Him, and He always finds a way!
Merry Christmas to everyone! I hope it was a blessed time for all.
I love these stories. Stories when Christ is found, not just Christianity. A book I've been reading recently that I think would resonate deeply with you is Room "For Good Things To Run Wild" by Josh Nadeau.
We have copies of it avaliable for free in the shop right now until we run out. But we also have it in our shop library to check out!
Thanks for your contribution and depth of thought in these book clubs!
!!!!! This book is fantastic and has really helped me understand the Gospel more fully and clearly. Absolutely beautiful!
I think the thing that stands out for me in this chapter is the fact that Jesus WANTS to be known by us!!! As it states in pg. 57, He could have left us destitute of the knowledge of Himself, but He chose to pursue us despite our denial of Him and our wanderings. I see more clearly His heart and relentless pursuit of man — a desire for man to be in relationship with Him, by sending the only One that could recreate the image of the Father, to bring anew the heart of man. And on top of this beautiful truth, He reveals Himself to man in numerous ways. Amazing!!!
Another Gospel connection I had was that part of the reason God sent Jesus to earth as a man, was because man was searching for God among created things rather than the Creator. Romans 1:23. I am moved by how generous our God is.
Question to work through:
Angels don’t carry the image of God? Someone share some scripture and walk me through this please!
So enjoying this reading!!
That's right, angels do not bear the Image of God. They are not made in His likeness. They are created with a different purpose and design. We get insight into this purpose in Hebrews 2: "13And to which of the angels has he ever said, “Sit at my right hand
until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet”? 14Are they not all ministering spirits sent out to serve for the sake of those who are to inherit salvation?"
Angels have been created with various forms and purposes, but their overarching purpose is to serve God and those made in the Image of God: Man. Which brings me to our own purpose: to reflect the likeness of God, to make the invisible God visible in the world, glorifying Him. As those uniquely made in His Image, Humans are the only beings in creation which can do this. Angels cannot, which is part of what Hebrews is trying to establish when it asserts that Jesus was not an angel, but a Man. If angels were made in God's Image, they would have been redeemed by Jesus sacrifice as well, but as it is, they are not and cannot be redeemed by Jesus' death and resurrection.
All make sense?
Again I am reminded how God is so relational and personal. He desires to be known; He is not a far-off God. Page 59 gets into this, "He had not hidden Himself from the sight of men, nor given the knowledge of Himself in one way only; but rather, He had unfolded it in many forms and by many ways." God has given us so many opportunities to see Him and know Him. Praise Him! This is so very different from every other religion and it burdens my hear to know that so many people are devoted to gods who don't love them and don't care about them. If only they knew the Truth!
As Athanasius explains on page 65, humans have looked to the created to find objects of worship, among the 'things of sense.' This made me think of 1 Samuel 8. Where the people of God are desiring a human king to judge and govern them, because they had rejected God as their king. They were turning to the created, to the things of sense. Yes, God does give them earthly, purely human kings but eventually and ultimately He gives us King Jesus, the God-Man. He answers their desire with Himself. He gives us a human king who can perfectly rule and govern as God, but also reveals God to us in a very personal way.
Questions:
Page 59 states that "being made in His image was sufficient to give them knowledge of the Word." Is this referring to a conscience that all humans have? Just because we are made in the Image and are 'reasonable,' that should point us to the Creator? I think of Romans 2:14-15, that everyone has a conscience and should be able to see how their conscience points to a creator. Is this what Athanasius is saying here?
Page 67 speaks of Jesus's omnipresence. I understand how Jesus's mind is not contained, how He is still upholding the universe with the word of His power. But I am curious if this means He was also present in heaven while His body was doing ministry on earth? Or is it that He was only physically present in one place but spiritually present everywhere? How does this work?
To your first question: I think Athanasius answers your question on page 58 when he says, "through this gift of Godlikeness in themselves they may be able to perceive the Image Absolute, that is the Word Himself, and through Him to apprehend the Father". I think what we gain by being "like God," namely our reason and rationality, enables us to perceive the One we were made after the likeness of: Jesus. And in coming to know Jesus, we come to know the Father, for they are one, Jesus being the Image of the Father, the exact imprint of His nature.
To your second question: this is a tough one. I think I would say the Word of God was, and is now, both in one place as He is embodied in the person of Jesus, and also omnipresent as the spiritual power through which all things are being held together. This is a bit sticky and I'm not sure of all the implications of that explanation, but I think that is how I would understand the nature of the Word's dwelling in creation. Would be a good question to bring to more people around you!
Hey Jaelyn!!! Great connecting with you here! I really appreciate your thoughts and questions. I don’t have answers, but am just here to say that I appreciate your intentionality and thought. Praise God for community and this study!!
Found a few good nuggets in this chapter 🧐
"You cannot put straight in others what is warped in yourself." Page 63
This is why Jesus needed to come.
This is also why, even today, we need the Spirit to draw people to Himself.
Sure, my words and actions can point to Him (fallen and warped as I am) but ultimately it is God to straighten the lives of His people. It is God only and He deserves all glory for it.
When talking about Jesus, Athanasius said, "He Himself is not man only but also God, the Word and Wisdom of the true God." Page 66
This is such a worshipful statement! It comes after saying how Jesus desired to centre our senses on Himself.
Reminds me of the many times my tummy has been growling and I can smell dinner cooking. All I can think about and all I can wait for is a plate full of food in front of me 😋
Do I wait for my Savior like that? Do I approach His Word each morning hungry and wanting to be satisfied?
What a beautiful picture this puts in my mind 🥰
Athanasius ends this section with "The Self-revealing of the Word is in every dimension ... All things have been filled with the knowledge of God."
Makes me want to intentionally look for God throughout my day, especially at work when it's easy to forget I'm a Christian first and an employee second.
When reading through this chapter and everyone's comments, I am reminded of all the ways (both known and unknown) that God works in each of our lives.
Using my own life as an example, it is quite amazing to look at the last 8 years (high school graduation until today) and recognize the undeniable hand that Jesus has played in my path. To give just a brief overview -- I grew up in the Lutheran church, was baptized as a baby, and completed confirmation classes during my middle school years.
I took a government class in high school and was formally introduced to politics. At the time, I loathed the way Christianity was represented in politics and felt I didn't see my own reflection in the events and behaviors playing out in our country. Ignorantly, I decided that Christianity was a main part of the problem and decided to remove myself from the church, as I no longer believed I belonged. (Reflecting on this now, I think a significant portion of this misguided belief was a failure to recognize a personal relationship with God and instead viewing Christianity as a "hive mind" or mass mode of thinking.)
I stayed away from church for about 5 years. I spent 3.5 of these years in a serious relationship with someone who was a fervent Christ-denier and openly mocked both Christians and Christianity. However, during those same years, I was exposed to some of his best friends. They were some of the kindest, warmest, brightest people I've met in my life -- all of them devout believers, Christians through and through. I felt at home with these people and had my first re-exposures to Christianity in their presence. After that relationship ended, I did a lot reflecting and soul-searching, and I decided that Christianity cannot be that bad if those people were so good. I decided to give things another go (this was 1.5 years ago), and I remember my first church service, essentially as a "new Christian" who hadn't seriously practiced as an adult. The first words of the service were a welcome and acknowledgement that no matter who you were, what you believed, or what you'd been through, you were welcome. Dear reader, I was nearly in tears!
Although I don't frequent that church anymore, I haven't looked back. Mere months after this first service, I met the man who would become my husband. It was only then that I remembered, 8 years ago, some of the last prayers I prayed were for a "good, Christian man" to be my partner in life. God delivered on that, too!
I'm sure we all have stories like this, and I know we can find lots of examples in the Bible as well. I often think about how important mission work is and find myself worrying about people who haven't had the opportunity to be exposed to Jesus. What happens to them if they didn't even have a chance to learn? But, in reading this chapter and thinking through experiences like my own, I'm reminded that we can look to each other and find God in one another. Athanasius points it out as well, noting that God sent prophets to help us learn of Him if we aren't able to discern him throughout the tangible universe. Jesus desires to know us and for us to know Him, and He always finds a way!
Merry Christmas to everyone! I hope it was a blessed time for all.
I love these stories. Stories when Christ is found, not just Christianity. A book I've been reading recently that I think would resonate deeply with you is Room "For Good Things To Run Wild" by Josh Nadeau.
We have copies of it avaliable for free in the shop right now until we run out. But we also have it in our shop library to check out!
Thanks for your contribution and depth of thought in these book clubs!